"Alternatives"

[tolman]

Gordon's extraordinary skills have attracted the attention of university scientists researching the paranormal,...

Given that this particular bloke, like numerous other 'psychics' has no doubt attracted the attention of many people who think he's a fraud or deluded, I'm not sure that simple 'attention' counts for much.

[bindeweede]

Given that this particular bloke, like numerous other 'psychics' has no doubt attracted the attention of many people who think he's a fraud or deluded, I'm not sure that simple 'attention' counts for much.

The "university scientists" Smith has worked with are no other than...

Gordon has worked with Professor Archie Roy, Emeritus Professor of Astronomy at Glasgow University and Tricia Robertson of the Scottish Society for Psychical Research. Both are trying to establish a scientific approach to studying the evidence given by mediums to their recipients in order to dispel the age-old claim of the sceptic that information given by mediums is no more than general.

The same team that Gary Mannion has claimed are investigating his abilities.

http://www.thepsychicbarber.co.uk/ab...tml#scientific

[bindeweede]

I have no idea about Smith's supernatural abilities, but his money-generating abilities seem impressive.

Saturday 18th & Sunday 19th October 2008 A weekend of Mediumship and Psychic skills with Gordon Smith and Mary Armour
Brighton
Ticket Price from £199 (Allocated seating)
Venue: The Britannia Room, The Royal Albion Hotel, 35 Old Steine, Brighton, Sussex, BN1 1NT
Time: 10:00 am - 5:00 pm
Tel Hay House Publishers: 020 8962 1230

http://www.thepsychicbarber.co.uk/PBFrameset.html

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

This nonsense about him being tested just keeps getting trotted out continuously. It's nonsense.

[Admin]

I have no idea about Smith's supernatural abilities, but his money-generating abilities seem impressive.

http://www.thepsychicbarber.co.uk/PBFrameset.html

But he doesn't charge for readings - which is a guarantee that he's genuine!!!

Mind you, he probably doesn't do many readings in between the other genuine stuff he does that makes money.

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

I have no idea about Smith's supernatural abilities, but his money-generating abilities seem impressive.

http://www.thepsychicbarber.co.uk/PBFrameset.html

I'm sure there were about 70 people at one of these previous sessions. Nice earner for a couple of days work.

[bindeweede]

Steve Nobel, a Director of "Alternatives" is giving a talk at the Theosophical Society.

2 November, 2 pm

LIVING MAGICALLY IN THE EVERYDAY WORLD
Steve Nobel

Learn how to use magic in ordinary and extraordinary ways. At the heart of all magical traditions are a number of principles or guiding laws that determine both our spiritual journey and how our personal and collective reality come together. Knowing how to these laws opens the way for joyful growth and successful living. Steve Nobel is a director of Alternatives, an NLP Practitioner and a student of the magical arts. Arranged by The Theosophical Society in England. £12, £9 concessions, £6 members of the Theosophical Society.

This might explain his less than full co-operation over Mannion.


http://www.theosophical-society.org..../syllabus.html


And guess who is turning up on November 21st.!!!!!

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Gary Mannion is a 20 year old Indigo Child blessed with amazing psychic and healing gifts. Tonight he returns to the Theosophical Society to again allow Spirit Surgeon ‘Abraham’ to come through and demonstrate non-invasive and safe psychic surgery.
Admission: £7, £5 concessions, £3 to members of the Theosophical Society

So amazing we have no actual proof they exist.

I see it is now non-invasive as opposed to evasive.

I don't really know what a demonstration entails - does it actually mean he heals someone? Or just waving his hands about and talking bullshit to attract more customers?

[bindeweede]

So amazing we have no actual proof they exist.

I see it is now non-invasive as opposed to evasive.

I don't really know what a demonstration entails - does it actually mean he heals someone? Or just waving his hands about and talking bullshit to attract more customers?

Now that I have seen 2 of his demonstrations, I would say the latter part of your last sentence is correct.

[bindeweede]

Of course, they are demonstrations of nothing. Mannion places his hands on various parts of the body, talks to the audience, and tells the "patient" they will feel a difference in 4,6,8,10,12 days or whatever.

They are procedures to promote Mannion. As Kitkat said, publicity stunts.

Targeting the vulnerable or simply daft.

[Dubious Dick]

Of course, they are demonstrations of nothing. Mannion places his hands on various parts of the body, talks to the audience, and tells the "patient" they will feel a difference in 4,6,8,10,12 days or whatever.

They are procedures to promote Mannion. As Kitkat said, publicity stunts.

Targeting the vulnerable or simply daft.

Does this mean that we have a believer who is denouncing a 'psychic'? That would appear to be a breakthrough. Did see the comments from KitKat but have not looked at any Spiritlove discussion on this.

There was some discussion about whether believers, even while claiming that they are skeptical of some 'psychics', could ever really bring themselves to denounce one because it might open the floodgates.

Certainly great respect to Kit Kat if she has had the courage to come out on Mannion. Maybe the first step to enlightenment?

Believe that Chillzero could really help a lot of the believers to see a better way forward as she has done. So difficult I guess to give up cherished beliefs.

Matt mentioned to me the Derren Brown book where he talks about his time as a religious evangelist and how anyone who argued with them was characterised as bearing satans message.

The more I delve into this the more I see that it is the sellers and not the buyers who must be targetted. And the harder the sell, the more naysaying is required.

[Julia]

Well said, DD! It would be great if KitKat would agree to take part in the documentary so it doesn't look quite so much like a Sceptics vs. Poor Persecuted New Ager thing.

By the way, I'm hoping to get a doctor's opinion on the new testimonials that have appeared on Gary's site over the past few months. It would also be nice if Gary bothered to answer Bindweede's e-mail asking him to clarify if Roy, Robertson and Oldfield are now the "leading medical professionals" with whom he's worked...

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Of course, they are demonstrations of nothing. Mannion places his hands on various parts of the body, talks to the audience, and tells the "patient" they will feel a difference in 4,6,8,10,12 days or whatever.

They are procedures to promote Mannion. As Kitkat said, publicity stunts.

Targeting the vulnerable or simply daft.

At £5 or £10 a time (£50 for his workshops.....), it's not just publicity but also a nice earner. Very little of which likely goes anywhere near the VAT or tax man.

[FarSideOfTheMoon]

Does this mean that we have a believer who is denouncing a 'psychic'? That would appear to be a breakthrough. Did see the comments from KitKat but have not looked at any Spiritlove discussion on this.

There was some discussion about whether believers, even while claiming that they are skeptical of some 'psychics', could ever really bring themselves to denounce one because it might open the floodgates.

.....

It is uncommon, but not unknown. When faced with overwhelming evidence, believers do change their minds. Unfortunately, they start from totally the wrong position.

They believe in psychics and healers. If someone says they are a psychic or a healer they are therefore considered genuine. If anyone criticises said psychic or healer, the psychic or healer is defended by the believer.

Not always that simplistic obviously, but most of the time that's the way it goes. Some gentle skeptical input does usually get the reasoned believer to criticall assess their thought process though without forcing them to change their opinion.

It's a strange one, because in any other walk of life the believer, or any person for that matter, demands some sort of proof as to someone's ability to do what they claim they can.

You don't assume that someone who says they are a doctor actually is until you get some sort of proof. Similarly if I said I was a fighter pilot, you'd struggle to believe that until given some credible proof. Yet we know that people can fly planes, and no one has ever been able to prove they speak to the dead. So am I more likely to be a fighter pilot than Gary Mannion is a psychic healer?

[Nasib]

No great revelation there. No spectacular 'turnaround'. My (Kitkat's) views on Gary Mannion and the 'Indigo' fairytales have not changed in any way from the inception of the discussions here, and the two extensive relative threads on Spiritlove. Only difference is that some 55 pages later and 1400 posts of extensive discussion (on Spiritlove), having now had the chance to see for myself, I am now in a position to voice my opinions with some conviction - and comparison.

As to the 'believer' reference, the same can be said for any other matter requiring evidence or proof, as is evident througout the Spiritlove forum, on many different topics, third party accounts and hearsay hold no firm ground. I speak with conviction, and without bias, on those matters that I have personally researched and experienced [thoroughly] for myself.