Alcohol at 50p per unit

[chaggle]

This is being proposed as a method of getting the population to cut down on drinking. Anybody think it might work? The thing that struck me is that as pub prices are already far higher than that and I only ever drink out, rarely at home, then a) It won't affect me and b) It might have the beneficial side-effect of easing the decline in the pub trade.

I'm for it.

[Tony Williams]

I agree, those were my thoughts when I heard the news. Traditional pubs can do with all the help they can get - just as long as they don't offer "happy hours" or "all you can drink for £X".

[Croydon Bob]

I'm not against but I'm not convinced. How will this actually work? Has there ever been any other product with a legal minimum price? It seems harsh that an offy wouldn't be able to flog off surplus stock cheap but will end up having to lose perfectly good beer or risk a fine for selling at half-price. Why not just increase tax if it is such an important health issue? That's all that has been done with tobacco, no 'minimum price' for cheap fags, just loadsatax.

[ZERO]

Is there any evidence that increasing price decreases consumption?

You can brew your own beer and roll your own smokes and then you have more, cheaper.
I would think it would only pinch low income people anyway.
Seems more like revenue raising instead of health improvement.

[bindeweede]

Is there any evidence that increasing price decreases consumption?

You can brew your own beer and roll your own smokes and then you have more, cheaper.
I would think it would only pinch low income people anyway.
Seems more like revenue raising instead of health improvement.

Many years ago I visited Finland where tax on booze was extremely high, and spirits only available from the state-run Alko shops. Helsinki railway station still had loads of drunks lying around. Of course the long, dark, cold winters would be an influence.

I came across this as a way of spending less on your booze....

But in the worst case, dress like a girl and then you might get some drink paid

http://www.finlandlive.info/living-f...se-2009-a.html

[bobdezon]

People will drink, no matter the price. Drug addicts pay extortionate amounts for some drugs, and yet they always seem to get what they need. If this takes root as a precautionary measure, they will also increase the base price of anything else they think the public will accept. I am against this, as I think it is an utter waste of time. If they really want people to stop drinking, then they should give them alternatives for recreational pursuit, instead of taxing what they have become accustomed to.

[Tony Williams]

I don't think that increasing the price of cheap booze would stop confirmed boozers from drinking (the proponents of this move claim only a 7% reduction in consumption as likely), but it might discourage some from becoming heavy drinkers in the first place. It also ought to help preserve pubs by increasing the cost of cheap supermarket booze to nearer to the price of pub beer. At the moment, our pubs are being killed off because you can buy bulk beer at a supermarket for a small fraction of their price; the supermarkets use it as a loss-leader. I like pubs, I hate to see them go.

[bruce]

This debate has been going on for months in Scotland, as the death rates attributable to alcohol are roughly double the rates for England.

24 can packs of lager for £7 or premium vodka at £6 for a 70cl bottle

aunty beeb

[chaggle]

People will drink, no matter the price. Drug addicts pay extortionate amounts for some drugs, and yet they always seem to get what they need.

I don't think that increasing the price of cheap booze would stop confirmed boozers from drinking (the proponents of this move claim only a 7% reduction in consumption as likely), but it might discourage some from becoming heavy drinkers in the first place. It also ought to help preserve pubs by increasing the cost of cheap supermarket booze to nearer to the price of pub beer. At the moment, our pubs are being killed off because you can buy bulk beer at a supermarket for a small fraction of their price; the supermarkets use it as a loss-leader. I like pubs, I hate to see them go.

I agree with all of the above.

This shows alcohol per head by country

#1 Luxembourg:15.5 litres per capita
#2 France:14.8 litres per capita
#3 Ireland:13.5 litres per capita
#4 Hungary:13.4 litres per capita
#5 Czech Republic:12.1 litres per capita
#6 Spain:11.7 litres per capita
#7 Denmark:11.5 litres per capita
#8 Portugal:11.4 litres per capita
#9 United Kingdom:11.2 litres per capita
#10 Austria:11.1 litres per capita

So the UK is well down from France and below Spain (both of which I was wrongly about to quote as having lower consumption rates than the UK even though alcohol prices are lower.)

Certainly in Spain you don't see much bingeing amongst the local population but then many do have Brandy or Aguardiente with their coffee before work and continue to drink steadily throughout the day.

Given the above list, does the UK actually have that much of a problem?

[Mulder]

While we're on the subject, whose brilliant idea was 'units'? As a tool in public health education it is pathetic. How long do you think it took them to decide on the name? And unless units are marked on bottles, you can't tell how many you are drinking anyway. The number of units can vary significantly from brand to brand. The current TV advert, showing the number of units on glasses, simply underlines the fact that no one has a clue how many they are drinking anyway, always assuming they even care.

[chaggle]

While we're on the subject, whose brilliant idea was 'units'? As a tool in public health education it is pathetic. How long do you think it took them to decide on the name? And unless units are marked on bottles, you can't tell how many you are drinking anyway. The number of units can vary significantly from brand to brand. The current TV advert, showing the number of units on glasses, simply underlines the fact that no one has a clue how many they are drinking anyway, always assuming they even care.

1 unit = 10ml of pure alcohol so why we don't just use ml's instead is a bit puzzling. The limits would be 30 - 40 per day (men) and 20 - 30 per day (women). A 1/2 pint of beer at 3.5% would be 10 units and a stronger beer 15 - 20 and so on. Easy!

It would also be easy (very) to state on a container how much alcohol is in the container. Pub measures would of course be a little more tricky but most (all?) pubs have a price list - it wouldn't be too difficult to put ml's of alcohol alongside the price. Of course some would simply compare price with the strength and buy the cheapest/strongest.

[polomint38]

While we're on the subject, whose brilliant idea was 'units'? As a tool in public health education it is pathetic. How long do you think it took them to decide on the name? And unless units are marked on bottles, you can't tell how many you are drinking anyway. The number of units can vary significantly from brand to brand. The current TV advert, showing the number of units on glasses, simply underlines the fact that no one has a clue how many they are drinking anyway, always assuming they even care.

Definitely on alcopops, beers, ciders etc.. the number of units is shown on bottles and cans. (pleb drinks, we need controlling)

On wines and spirits (probably because these are shared) the ABV is shown (which is enough info to work out units.)

The thing is after a few, you are not checking the bottles for info, just going with the flow.

*cross post with the marvelous chaggle so maybe some shared thoughts*

chaggle, all pubs do have price lists which show alcohol content, unfortunately they are often badly positioned.

[chaggle]

BTW I don't know how significant this is but I get the feeling that the main concern is about young people getting completely bladdered on Friday and Saturday nights, however the three serious alcoholics I know drink almost exclusively at home. I like to drink (too much) but I like to socialise at the same time. I see home drinking as a bit sad and somewhat dangerous. Just my opinion.

(edit)

(the marvelous chaggle?)

[polomint38]

BTW I don't know how significant this is but I get the feeling that the main concern is about young people getting completely bladdered on Friday and Saturday nights, however the three serious alcoholics I know drink almost exclusively at home. I like to drink (too much) but I like to socialise at the same time. I see home drinking as a bit sad and somewhat dangerous. Just my opinion.

(edit)

(the marvelous chaggle?)

Probably down to too much drinking at home, by myself, on my own, give me an ahhh!!

[Tony Williams]

Given the above list, does the UK actually have that much of a problem?

Averages can conceal large variations. It could mean that a small percentage of the population drinks one hell of a lot while the rest drink little. And it could also conceal the possibility that people get totally wrecked on Friday night and drink nothing for the rest of the week. Both patterns of consumption will lead to far more drunkenness and health problems than if everyone drank the average amount, spread evenly over the week, preferably with meals.