Madeleine McCann: here come the psychic predators.

[Admin]

Well, it normally takes around 7 to 10 days after a murder or missing person case has been in the news before the psychics start coming out of the woodwork hoping to cash in on others' misfortune.

True to form, we have our first one today. A reader has sent me this link to the GMTV forums: http://chatroom.gm.tv/forums/showthr...page=30&p=5143

I've never heard of Stuart Higman nor does he come up on Google but he's made a few claims here and indicated that he's passed his 'info' on to the police.

Just in case the posting gets removed by GMTV here's a copy:

To whom it may concern

I am a practicing medium and on Wed 2 May at 0730 I had a vision of a very young girl with shoulder length blonde hair sitting between a white male and white female in the rear of a white car (possibly Mercedes style), the girl was wearing a red top and white bottoms. I would describe both the female and male as being of medium build with brown hair both IC1. I also saw another male who I would describe as being of slim build, dark skinned, black hair(possible moustache) wearing a white top, this male I feel I could produce a photofit, he was attempting to conceal himself behind a while wall next to a broken vent/shutter.

At this time I felt a great sense of fear or despair.

On Sun 6 May I saw the same dark skinned male looking out from either a balcony or doorway, he appeared to be looking down a road lined with white walled houses with red flowers in baskets hanging on the walls. The road was going down hill towards a communal/shopping area next to the sea.

On Mon 7 May I saw blue sky and a sandy beach with crowds of people wandering around of all different nationalities, a carrousel and a child wrapped in a fawn coloured blanket and the number 49. I'm unsure as to whether it is door number or part of a vehicle registration number as I had glimpses of this sequence E 49 NM.

I have attempted to forward this information onto someone in authority and it was given to the Staff of Gosport Police Station at 0815 today in the hope they would forward it on and I hope they have. Please do not dismiss this email as a hoax, I can ashore you it is not I have recently completed 22yrs service in the Royal Navy as a Service Policeman which can be substantiated.

As to Madeleine's whereabouts I believe she is currently in TOULOUSE, FRANCE.

I forward this email to you in the hope you find her safe and well and she is returned safe to her family.

Regards

[vbloke]

Well, it normally takes around 7 to 10 days after a murder or missing person case has been in the news before the psychics start coming out of the woodwork hoping to cash in on others' misfortune.

True to form, we have our first one today. A reader has sent me this link to the GMTV forums: http://chatroom.gm.tv/forums/showthr...page=30&p=5143

I've never heard of Stuart Higman nor does he come up on Google but he's made a few claims here and indicated that he's passed his 'info' on to the police.

In these cases, "passing info" usually means "I phoned the official helpline and told them my vague impressions" - anything that can be retrofitted after the event.

I really do wonder why people like this aren't prosecuted for wasting police time.

[tkingdoll]

Christ, why the hell can't these people differentiate between 'overactive imagination' and 'special ability'?

[Araneus]

Please do not dismiss this email as a hoax, I can ashore you it is not I have recently completed 22yrs service in the Royal Navy as a Service Policeman which can be substantiated.

Well that's good enough for me. I can't think of any better qualification for a psychic than being a semi-literate retired Navy Policeman.

[Admin]

On reading the thread there was one respondent who claims to have emailed Uri Geller because he has a well-known reputation for dowsing over maps - and someone stated that the 'well-respected' psychic Sally Morgan should be called in.

On the whole though, despite how atrocious the level of thinking on the topic is on there, there is not much said about psychics etc.

Perhaps this is a good sign as it shows that even the GMTV demographic is not really sold on the idea of psychic detectives.

[Jocky]

a white male and white female in the rear of a white car ... I also saw another male

This is of course the exact composition of the suspect group seen on CCTV who the Police are already trying to trace.

Recycling info already in the public domain, with the intention of claiming it as a 'hit'. How lame can you get

[Admin]

I thought things were getting a little overdue. Here we go:

I saw this on the JREF: http://www.holymoly.co.uk/index.php?...d=526&Itemid=9

Hi,

We've just had this great story come about a couple of our clients and thought that it may be of interest to you.

Two UK psychic detectives have arrived in Portugal in a bid to help track down missing toddler Madeleine McCann.

Amanda Hart from St Albans and Ben Murphy from Watford believe their psychic powers could provide the missing key in finding the three year old who has been missing since last Thursday.

Madeleine is believed to have been taken from her bed while her parents were eating at a nearby restaurant close to their holiday apartment in the Algarve village of Praia da Luz in Portugal.

They had been regularly checking on her and their two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, before she went missing.

Amanda Hart, who has appeared on Tricia Goddards Psychic Challenge and regularly presented her own psychic radio show, says she has been receiving vital clues as to the childs whereabouts. Her partner, Ben Murphy who was involved in helping track down the murderer of teenager Sally Anne Bowman last year, has also had psychic impressions of her location.

The pair arrived in Portugal on Friday and are hoping to use Amanda’s ability as a psychic ‘tracker’ to help find Madeleine.

Spokesman Kizzi Nkwocha said: “Both Amanda and Ben have proven their psychic abilities beyond any doubt. They now hope to use these powers to help find Madeleine. Any information they get will be made available to the authorities in Portugal.”

If you'd like any further information about Amanda and Ben or news of their progress, please feel free to contact Kizzi Nkwocha on the following number or email.

Kizzi Nkwocha

Tel: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

www.prhq.co.uk

Amanda Hart who featured on Britain's Psychic Challenge and Ben Murphy who was one of the psychic detectives who involved himself in the Sally Anne Bowman case with the likes of Joe Power. Of course they were wildly wrong as was shown when Mark Dixie was arrested for the murder.

[BeverlyM]

I do think it is about time that psychic and intuitive gifts received some respect on this site. I was the person who wrote on the GMTV site that I had emailed Uri Geller to ask if he might be able to dowse a map for Madeleine's whereabouts. There is a growing body of valid and recorded work by (a handful of) exceptional psychics who have quietly worked with police in the past, and who have proven their ability and results. We are right to be sceptical, but not to the point of arrogance; after all, we are most of us using a fraction of our mental and intuitive capacity - on a planet which at times is very far from 'human' or decent in the way it should be. Some of us have breaking hearts at what has happened to Madeleine; we look for ways to help. I do know personally several gifted intuitives who are trying to tune in and help - quietly, and certainly not for money. I do think that should be respected and welcomed because already some information is coming forward which could be vital. Our prayers for Madeleine and her family are also needed every day.

[vbloke]

I do think it is about time that psychic and intuitive gifts received some respect on this site.

I agree - as soon as any can show they even have any ability.

I was the person who wrote on the GMTV site that I had emailed Uri Geller to ask if he might be able to dowse a map for Madeleine's whereabouts.

You do realise that Geller is a 100% fraud, don't you? He has been debunked time and again.

There is a growing body of valid and recorded work by (a handful of) exceptional psychics who have quietly worked with police in the past, and who have proven their ability and results.

Then where is this proof? If any so called psychic had definitively proved they had their claimed ability, it would be worldwide headline news.

Also, the police have clearly stated that they do not use psychics.

We are right to be sceptical, but not to the point of arrogance; after all, we are most of us using a fraction of our mental and intuitive capacity - on a planet which at times is very far from 'human' or decent in the way it should be.

I'm skeptical because there is no proof. Show me some and I'll change my tune.

If you're referring to the "we only use 10% of our brain" myth, I'm afraid that's been debunked many times over as well.

Some of us have breaking hearts at what has happened to Madeleine; we look for ways to help.

I really hope that she is found alive and well - but I can guarantee that it won't be because of any psychic.

I do know personally several gifted intuitives who are trying to tune in and help - quietly, and certainly not for money. I do think that should be respected and welcomed because already some information is coming forward which could be vital. Our prayers for Madeleine and her family are also needed every day.

Tell them to contact us here then and we can arrange to test them - it needn't be for the JREF $1 million - we can test them free of any negative connotations with the JREF challenge.

I'm afraid that praying won't help either - the only thing that will is if she is found alive and well. If she is, you can claim that prayer works, if not, it would never be mentioned that the prayers didn't work.

Personally, I hope she is found alive - any such incident involving a child is a tragedy and I hope that this is resolved quickly for the parents and child's sake, but no amount of prayer or psychic ability will bring her back any quicker.

[Admin]

Beverly,

Having good intentions and being a well-meaning person is all good and well but having good intentions does not necessarily lead to making good decisions.

When someone goes missing or is abducted (as seems to be the case with Madeleine) it is vital that as many resources as possible are used in the search in the most efficient way. i.e. a proven, systematic approach. This is the best way, although sadly not always successful, of finding the missing person.

Now, there is an argument that anything and/or everything that can be possibly done is worth a try. It sounds reasonable, but is it?

I say no. The reason being that resources are finite and they need to be targeted in the most appropriate areas of investigation to maximise the chance of a successful outcome.

One of the biggest wastes of resources would be if the police started opening up areas of inquiry on the 'information' of psychics. The reason I say this is because (despite what you may believe) psychics cannot actually do what they claim to do.

As skeptics we deal in facts. If the facts supported the idea that psychics were of any use in solving missing persons (or indeed any other) cases then we would be joining you in calling for their use. But the facts do not support psychics' claims.

That's a practical reason for opposing the use of psychics in these cases. Their input would be useless; and if followed, would lead to a waste of police time and resources and make a successful outcome less likely.

There's also the emotional damage they cause to families. See Kelly Jolkowski's blog.

And also, many psychics involve themselves with these high-profile cases as they're great for free publicity, which is helped by a credulous media who report their involvement in these cases but never follow up the story when the psychic fails.

For a few examples of how psychics' claims don't match reality see:

Diane Lazarus:
The Mark Green case.
The Muriel Drinkwater case and here.
The Ipswich murders.

Joe Power:
Lyndsey Quy murder.
Sally Anne Bowman case.

And what about this piece of stupidity from Geller:
Clairvoyant led Americans to Saddam.

And another article with links to all sorts of psychic claims:
The skeptic express: psychic detectives or psychic predators?

So, that should make it fairly clear that these psychics are not only useless in these cases but are in fact a hindrance. Nothing they come up with can be trusted as accurate, and all they're really in it for is the publicity and a self-serving image boost.

So no, we do not 'respect' these people and most of us hold them in utter contempt. They are simply using other people's grief for their own ends. Which is utterly disgusting.

[BeverlyM]

I'm interested to see so much hard-core scepticism here (although,
given the title of the site, that should not be surprising). However,
if you would like to see some valuable psychic work why not go to
the following site: www.caroleverett.com. You will see there psychic
drawings produced before any police evidence which are well worth
your consideration.

It is so sad and inappropriate to dismiss the fact that there are some
gifted people who can help in these dreadful cases, and have done so.
It is simply not true that 'police don't use psychic help'. They do, and
there is well-documented material to prove it. (I don't have time to give you publications and authors, but they most certainly exist and
can be found through most public libraries.)

Surely, if the human race is to progress beyond its more pitiful and
horrific elements, we need an open mind as to how we can move
beyond the present stage of very limited human and spiritual development? There was a time, after all, when radio waves were thought impossible, and before that time, that the motor car would combust if it went faster than 12 mph. You see my trend. There is no excuse for blind ignorance and closed minds. I'm sorry to have found it on your site and especially in connection with this terrible tragedy.

[BeverlyM]

A PS if I may: The Yoga tradition over thousands of years describes the human being as having multi-dimensions. Not just the physical but also subtle energy fields, chakras, mental/emotional body, etheric body.
The third eye in this system is acknowledged as potentially opening and
developing so that intuition and inner-seeing becomes possible. (I have
been privileged to experience the third-eye and it is a glorious, rainbow-coloured, pulsing, moving wheel). Within this model, Light is acknowledged as being real, accessible and potentially part of healing
energy. Unless a person can study this philosophy, and move from the
three-dimensional view of the human, to one which includes four and
perhaps even more dimensions, then the logical perspective only will
prevail. It is rather like trying to explain the depth and nature of the
oceans to someone who insists that only the boat and the surface of the water is real.

The existing literature on out-of-body experiences also relates to this philosophy, and is the subject of clinical research through Dr. Peter Fenwick and his colleagues at Charing Cross Hospital, currently with cardiac arrest patients. Peter Fenwick's publications are listed on Amazon for reference. His work, as I understand it, is to research the
possibility that consciousness exists independently of the physical brain. Again, the research he presents is well worth reading in the
context of material under discussion (and the sceptical ridicule, it might be said) on this site.

[Admin]

I'm interested to see so much hard-core scepticism here

Are you equating skepticism with disbelief?

One of the main features of those who attack skepticism is that they don't know what it is.

However,
if you would like to see some valuable psychic work why not go to
the following site: www.caroleverett.com. You will see there psychic
drawings produced before any police evidence which are well worth
your consideration.

Certainly. I'll have a look.

It is so sad and inappropriate to dismiss the fact that there are some gifted people who can help in these dreadful cases

It certainly would be sad and inappropriate if such people existed.

It is simply not true that 'police don't use psychic help'. They do, and
there is well-documented material to prove it.

See: Police use of psychics.

Your claim, that you're too busy to back up, is at odds with what the police themselves actually say.

Surely, if the human race is to progress beyond its more pitiful and
horrific elements, we need an open mind as to how we can move
beyond the present stage of very limited human and spiritual development?

An open mind?

Funny how the credulous always think they're 'open minded'.

There was a time, after all, when radio waves were thought impossible, and before that time, that the motor car would combust if it went faster than 12 mph. You see my trend.

I'll fill in the details for you. "Skeptics thought the earth was flat".

It's a very naive argument, but another big favourite of credophiles.

There is no excuse for blind ignorance and closed minds.

Then perhaps you ought to open yours and realise that believing in things that are false is not such a smart thing to do.

I'm sorry to have found it on your site and especially in connection with this terrible tragedy

All I can say is that it's a bloody good job that the police (etc.) don't listen to fantasy-prone credophiles like you. As it is at least Madeleine has a chance of being found - if we went along with your psychic fantasy she'd have no hope.

Like I said, having good intentions is one thing but making good, rational, sound decisions is another.

Thankfully, most of us live in the real world.

[Dr B]

Beverely

There are (at least) two issues here. Firstly, no one here is theoretically against the possibility that psychic ability could exist. However, there is no reliable scientific evidence to suggest that it does - and so there is a high probability that it does not exist.

The second issue is to do with psychics using sad events like this to promote themselves and their belief systems. This is where most of us here start to feel very uncomfortable.

Vbloke and John have studied psychics and their claims from both here and the USA for some years and they are well aware of how psychics have failed with police cases. If you want to make the argument that some have been sucessful then please do return and provide scientific references for us to consider.

I think you might enjoy a discussion on psychic ability more than one on these charletons being real.

[vbloke]

I'm interested to see so much hard-core scepticism here (although, given the title of the site, that should not be surprising). However, if you would like to see some valuable psychic work why not go to the following site: www.caroleverett.com. You will see there psychic
drawings produced before any police evidence which are well worth
your consideration.

None of those drawings look anything like the suspects photos and it is very easy to retrofit something on the web after the fact. This proves nothing unless these drawings were done under controlled conditions.

Ask yourself why these psychics only go after the high profile cases - why don't they go for after the missing people who don't make it into the news, or help solve the low-key murders that we see every day in various newspapers. They don't because these cases are not high profile enough. If they really can do what they say they can, why not help as many people as possible, instead of only the high profile cases?
Why are they never mentioned as being key to investigations except by themselves?
Could it be because they're only in it for fame and themselves?

It is so sad and inappropriate to dismiss the fact that there are some gifted people who can help in these dreadful cases, and have done so.
It is simply not true that 'police don't use psychic help'. They do, and there is well-documented material to prove it. (I don't have time to give you publications and authors, but they most certainly exist and can be found through most public libraries.)

There are gifted people who can help in these dreadful cases - they're called the police. Let them do their job without bombarding them with potentially useless and misleading information.

Using the Freedom of Information Act, we have statements from the major police forces saying they DO NOT use psychics. Falsifying an FOI request is illegal. Make your own mind up as to who is telling the truth.

If you have this proof, please supply it. It is not for us to prove otherwise, since you are making the claim.

Surely, if the human race is to progress beyond its more pitiful and horrific elements, we need an open mind as to how we can move beyond the present stage of very limited human and spiritual development? There was a time, after all, when radio waves were thought impossible, and before that time, that the motor car would combust if it went faster than 12 mph. You see my trend. There is no excuse for blind ignorance and closed minds. I'm sorry to have found it on your site and especially in connection with this terrible tragedy.

Typical "science doesn't know everything" canards don't help your case.
No psychic EVER has been able to reliably replicate or produce results that stand up to scrutiny.

We here are fully prepared to change our minds if evidence comes to light regarding psychic powers, which is why we demand empirical evidence. It is people like you who are closed minded, refusing to see that there is no evidence for their claims, only anecdote and hearsay that does not stand up to scrutiny.

Like I said before, if psychic powers existed, it would be front page news throughout the world. Why do you think that we have never seen those headlines?

If we are to progress, don't you think it's time to put aside our superstitions and live in the real world and not a fantasy world where fairies and unicorns live?

If you open your mind, you'll actually see that there exists the possibility that there is no psychic or supernatural phenomena. Are you prepared to accept that premise?